China is preparing to militarise space…

[BoJangles2]

Does anyone else find this deeply distubing...

So this is where our countries hard earned dollars (lost through trade deficits) goes.

Personally I think China is getting more dangerous by the day.

A TOP China air force commander has called the militarisation of space an "historical inevitability", state media said today, marking an apparent shift in Beijing's opposition to weaponising outer space.
In a wide-ranging interview in the People's Liberation Army (PLA) Daily, air force commander Xu Qiliang said it was imperative for the PLA air force to develop offensive and defensive operations in outer space.

"As far as the revolution in military affairs is concerned, the competition between military forces is moving towards outer space... this is a historical inevitability and a development that cannot be turned back,'' Commander Xu told the paper.

"The PLA air force must establish in a timely manner the concepts of space security, space interests and space development.

"We must build an outer space force that conforms with the needs of our nation's development (and) the demands of the development of the space age.''

Link...

Ps. Militarise wasn’t a typo or mistake, just Australian spelling

[mental_avenger]

I consider it to be inevitable. In past discussions on “ownership” off Earth, the question of defending ownership always came up. I think that the answer was always the same. In space, everyone is pretty much on their own, and they aren’t going to be able to expect assistance from their country of origin. I doubt that treaties will be effective, so IMO militarization is inevitable.

Having said that, protecting countries on Earth from attacks based in space is another matter entirely. From space, they don’t even have to shoot at you, just throw large rocks.

[ZenGalacticore]

Who knows. It may turn out to be a blessing by helping to get the complacent American public off of their duffs when in comes to a proactive, vigorous space program.

Americans need a wake-up call and a swift kick in the rear. From a position of strength in space, only then can we keep from miliarizing it, or prevent a space-arms race. What a waste that will be. Like the Cold War, we will once again employ over half of the engineers and scientists of the world in the design, development, and production of weapons, and spending hundreds of billions of dollars on weapons we will never use. While we could be using all that money and employing scientists and engineers to design space habitats and develop new propulsion systems.

Still, competition and fear-not cooperation- got us to the Moon. Maybe the Chinese militarization of space will work similar miracles on our part.

[nimbus]

His position probably is representative of China's objectives now and possibly their actions in the future, but it's still just one quote from one person involved in today's full context years before it actually happens.

[jim48]

I find this most disturbing. President Eisenhower, at the dawn of the Space Age, set in motion space treaties banning nukes in orbit. Even the Russians signed up, once they realized that it is far easier and more cost-effective to fire off an ICBM than to maintain nukes in orbit. Ronald Reagan proposed the Strategic Defense Initiative, a defensive shield against incoming missiles. He really wanted a nuclear weapons-free world but realized at the same time that nukes were here to stay. Along come the Chinese, who have signed next to no space treaties and pretty much do as they damn well please in space. The new kids on the block. The kids have the keys to the car, and they are bad kids. Remember, it is still Communist Red China. I know they keep the WalMart shelves well stocked, but it is still Communist Red China. They have us by the balls economically and once they think they have a military advantage...

[nimbus]

We have them by the balls too. They are bound by that debt, not free of it. If you advance someone's (huge) debt out of your pocket, and that someone goes totally bankrupt, you're in trouble.

[SpacexULA]

Ronald Reagan proposed the Strategic Defense Initiative, a defensive shield against incoming missiles.

The kids have the keys to the car, and they are bad kids. Remember, it is still Communist Red China. I know they keep the WalMart shelves well stocked, but it is still Communist Red China. They have us by the balls economically and once they think they have a military advantage...

Jingoism at it's best

That missile "defense shield" would have also allowed the US to instantly disable any satellite in orbit, but that's all well and good as long as us "good old" American's can do it.

China is a developing nation, . They have a military budget of about $52 per capita, the US is sitting at $872 per person. (Isriael is at $1400, mostly on the American dime)

China has a military budget 1/10 the size of the US, or around the size of England or Japan (You know, the ones that used to own China as a colony?)

So what do you think, the US doesn't spend enough of defense yet? Or is it that ONLY the US has the right to a space based systems of war (Star Wars, GPS, Spy satellites)? Or maybe only the EU and US have the right to a respectable military?

Sometimes I forget it's the job of the rest of the world to do what WE in the US and EU tell them to. Obama needs to send a memo to China and tell them how to run a proper economy, and military. Meaning borrow 30% of your budget so you can spend 30% of your budget on a military larger than the rest of the world put together, while telling the nation you borrow that money from that, if the spend any more than 1/10 as much as we do, you are going to try to "take over" the world.

Honestly the EU, and US is only about 25% of the world. Do we honestly have the right to tell the rest of the world what do do just because we used to have all the money?

[jim48]

Ronald Reagan proposed the Strategic Defense Initiative, a defensive shield against incoming missiles.

The kids have the keys to the car, and they are bad kids. Remember, it is still Communist Red China. I know they keep the WalMart shelves well stocked, but it is still Communist Red China. They have us by the balls economically and once they think they have a military advantage...

Jingoism at it's best

That missile "defense shield" would have also allowed the US to instantly disable any satellite in orbit, but that's all well and good as long as us "good old" American's can do it.

China is a developing nation, . They have a military budget of about $52 per capita, the US is sitting at $872 per person. (Isriael is at $1400, mostly on the American dime)

China has a military budget 1/10 the size of the US, or around the size of England or Japan (You know, the ones that used to own China as a colony?)

So what do you think, the US doesn't spend enough of defense yet? Or is it that ONLY the US has the right to a space based systems of war (Star Wars, GPS, Spy satellites)? Or maybe only the EU and US have the right to a respectable military?

Sometimes I forget it's the job of the rest of the world to do what WE in the US and EU tell them to. Obama needs to send a memo to China and tell them how to run a proper economy, and military. Meaning borrow 30% of your budget so you can spend 30% of your budget on a military larger than the rest of the world put together, while telling the nation you borrow that money from that, if the spend any more than 1/10 as much as we do, you are going to try to "take over" the world.

Honestly the EU, and US is only about 25% of the world. Do we honestly have the right to tell the rest of the world what do do just because we used to have all the money?

What country do you live in and which side are you on? Theirs or ours? Please tell us now. Do you love freedom or communism?

[cosmictraveler]

America has already done this with many military satellites already up there "protecting" our "freedom". To stop others from doing the same is simply ignorant.

[Swampcat]

What country do you live in and which side are you on? Theirs or ours? Please tell us now. Do you love freedom or communism?

jim, I very often agree with you, but SpacexULA is right about the jingoism. There are certainly better ways of arguing your point than attacking someone's patriotism or loyalty.

Your choice of "freedom" vs "communism" is misguided. Freedom is not a form of government. I'm sure the Chinese think they have freedom, though both of us would likely disagree with them. We could just as easily explain such things as the Patriot Act, the Dept. of Homeland Security and our inexorable slide into statism as a choice between freedom and capitalism, but it would miss the point.

The Chinese have too much invested in the US to bother with a military takeover. They own us already because global oligarchies don't give a rat's behind who gets screwed, as long as their top officers and stockholders are taken care of. .

[Eman_3]

It is inevitable that space would be militarized. Despite treaties against weapons in space, the USA is aggressively pushing ahead with this. Last year they conducted a blatant ASAT mission, blowing up a satellite and creating a large debris cloud. Another example is the development of the X-37, and what it implies. Obviously, this is a carry-over from the original MOL concept, and that too is bringing weapons into space.

People have the right to self defence, and nations such as Russia and China have the same legal reasoning and valid moral imperative to self defence, and thus to also develop weapons in space.

As far as simply labelling the USA as the "good" guys and Chinese as the "bad" guys doesn't carry weight with me. In this case, the USA is the one forcing the issue. As well, the USA now has a very tarnished record on human rights and moral position.
In the last ten years the Chinese have not invaded any nations. The USA has, and left those nations much worse off than in the beginning. As far as I'm concerned, right now the USA are the bad guys.

[yevaud]

A small point to consider, for those who believe China will overtake us and be "dangerous" to us: China's "one family/one child" policy - and a wise one too, given their lack of space and resources - means that like Russia and Japan, they have a rapidly aging population that will actually shrink in the next several decades, while the number of aged and retirees will markedly grow.

[SpacexULA]

What country do you live in and which side are you on? Theirs or ours? Please tell us now. Do you love freedom or communism?

US Citizen. Also a human being. I expect my government to treat the world the same way it wishes to be treated. What entitles the US and Europe to the the morality police of the world, is it our great history of genocides, or our propensity to picck some nation every 20 years and decide that huge portions of their population needs to die?

Ohh and before you doubt my Americanism I am a Sheriff for my county, and have held office twice (once as a Republican).

I have a hard time seeing my government lambaste China' Tibet when I have an Indian reservation 20 miles from my house, at least they don't teach their children a game called Chinese and Tibetans (Cowboys and Indians). I love watching old westerns to cheer on America's most proud genocide! Go Ronald Regan go!! Chase those dirty Jews... I mean Armenians... I mean Tibetans... I'm sorry SAVAGES (Blood thirsty boozers arn't they)!!!

[jim48]

What country do you live in and which side are you on? Theirs or ours? Please tell us now. Do you love freedom or communism?

US Citizen. Also a human being. I expect my government to treat the world the same way it wishes to be treated. What entitles the US and Europe to the the morality police of the world, is it our great history of genocides, or our propensity to picck some nation every 20 years and decide that huge portions of their population needs to die?

Ohh and before you doubt my Americanism I am a Sheriff for my county, and have held office twice (once as a Republican).

I have a hard time seeing my government lambaste China' Tibet when I have an Indian reservation 20 miles from my house, at least they don't teach their children a game called Chinese and Tibetans (Cowboys and Indians). I love watching old westerns to cheer on America's most proud genocide! Go Ronald Regan go!! Chase those dirty Jews... I mean Armenians... I mean Tibetans... I'm sorry SAVAGES (Blood thirsty boozers arn't they)!!!

Apologies for doubting your patriotism. It stuns me nonetheless that you defend Communist China.

[Eman_3]

A small point to consider, for those who believe China will overtake us and be "dangerous" to us:

One thing that needs to be made clear is that eventually other nations, or combinations of nations will achieve military parity with the USA. Because of this, the regular citizens and the policymakers should take this into account when deciding foreign policy. If the policies are dictated by the belief that the US can do whatever it wants because it has the biggest guns, it will return to haunt the USA.

Once upon a time the US economy was the benchmark, and totally dominated the economies worldwide. Other nations did not accept this status, and now we see other nations and companies closing the gap, if not passing. Just look at GM, thirty years ago it appeared unassailable. But today it is no longer the largest car manufacturer worldwide, Toyota is. Boeing and Douglas owned the commercial airliner industry. Now, Airbus is presently in a dead heat with Boeing.

Other nations are looking at the great disparity in numbers and quality of the US hardware, and trust me, thinking of ways to close the gap, if not surpass it. For instance, China just recently made a major shift in it's military.

BEIJING (Reuters) - China's army will recruit 130,000 graduates from Chinese universities and colleges this winter to raise the quality of the armed forces and help solve the job crisis facing graduates.

Chinese sources last month told Reuters of a plan to cut the 2.3 million-strong People's Liberation Army by 700,000, mainly lower-skilled foot soldiers, while adding better-educated recruits able to serve in a technologically sophisticated force.

In other words China is moving to close the gap in technology. It's happening folks, you better get used to the idea.

The point is that the USA should learn to live with it's neighbours, instead of dictating to everyone. In the future the USA will not enjoy total military and economic dominance, and nations with grievances and grudges will exact their revenge.

[SpacexULA]

Apologies for doubting your patriotism. It stuns me nonetheless that you defend Communist China.

I didn't see you as doubting my patriotism, you questioned it. Considering my stances you are entitled to question my patriotism. Questions can never be offensive, only the answers given.

I don't defend them, I see what they do as similar to what the US does, and has done. We saw it in the US interest to murder MILLIONS of natives, China saw it in there interest to occupy, but not eradicate Tibet. The US did to Europe what China is doing to the US now, drain wealth from the more powerful nations by manipulating your currency and trade policy.

No nation should have as large of military as the US does. Imagine if I made 60 thousand dollars a year, and spent 20 thousand of it JUST on my home security system EVERY YEAR. It would be an insult to my family, and a sign of mental instability.

The #1 threat to every nation in the world is that the United States will decide that they are now part o the AXIS of EVIL. EVERY nation should invest in technologies to counter the US drastic

[doom_shepherd]

The US did to Europe what China is doing to the US now, drain wealth from the more powerful nations by manipulating your currency and trade policy.

And by this statement, you appear to believe that because somebody did something wrong in the past and was not punished, this makes it okay for someone to do something equally wrong in the present, and this should be unopposed.

It must have been interesting to be a criminal in your jurisdiction... do you let killers go free just because 40% of murders go unsolved and unpunished?

No nation should have as large of military as the US does. Imagine if I made 60 thousand dollars a year, and spent 20 thousand of it JUST on my home security system EVERY YEAR. It would be an insult to my family, and a sign of mental instability.

Math is off. It would be under 15 thousand, and if you spent about 16 thousand on doctor bills (medicare and Medicaid - $1,600 of which you simply burned - that accounts for medicare fraud) and put about 15 thousand away for retirement (Social Security)

The #1 threat to every nation in the world is that the United States will decide that they are now part o the AXIS of EVIL.

You write as though you've already decided that this happened. If I were being mean, I would class that among the "signs of mental instability" that you mentioned.

EVERY nation should invest in technologies to counter the US drastic

Bleh. If you'd studied military history, you'd know that US generally invested in superior technology to counter the NUMERICAL superiority of their opponents. Go on and look up the "human wave" attacks in Korea and Vietnam, among others. China was a big fan of that kind of tactic. The Warsaw pact had a similar level of numerical superiority over NATO for most of the Cold War.

Have you forgotten that the USSR had (and still has) many more nuclear warheads than the US had/has?

We invest more because when you get in a fight, the idea is to WIN.

(And also because everybody starts screaming for us when there's a fight.)

[a_lost_packet_]

Does anyone else find this deeply distubing...

I find such statements disturbing. It shows intent and that is disturbing enough.

I CAN see why they would believe such an initiative is necessary though.

Let's face it, the ability of the West to project force is orders of magnitude above that of any nation. There is no way that any other nation in the foreseeable future will be able to equal or overcome the West's capability in that department. However, that is assuming the playing field remains the same.

China has shown that it has the technology to move the playing field. It can redefine the ability to project force (nuclear/nonconventional) by moving the field to space. There, it can compete on a more level playing field by focusing its efforts there while the West remains in the conventional arena.

This is not good. It's not surprising but, actually seeing them make "official" statements of intent is unsettling. China has demonstrated its capabilities in low orbit. It has made its intentions there fairly clear. But, an "initiative" to vigorously pursue a space-weaponization doctrine puts a lot of stress on Western policy decisions as far as what direction we must choose for new advancements.

It doesn't worry me that China might gain an advantage there. It worries me that their initial capabilities there could be very destructive and a first-strike option would be an easy choice for them should they have the resources available. That can not be tolerated, IMO. Yes, I'm Pro-USA here. I can not tolerate such a display by China if they pursue such a strategy. It must be countered but not by bringing MAD to space. Nobody can afford an Earth ringed by weapons platforms targeting its own peoples.